Jesus Christ is God

I am not exactly mister gregarious; live mostly as a hermit, most of the time. From time to time, however, I enjoy a good conversation. I can’t seem to find as many good conversationalists around the truck stop anymore.

As of late I have had the misfortune of running into Seventh Day Adventists.  I can be having a perfectly good conversation with one until they find out that I am Catholic. Once they find out my faith; any good conversation we were having, on a range of topics, is out the window.

I can’t help but to believe that the Seventh Day Adventists are a cult and it’s members under some kind of mind control. I say this because they can’t seem to stop themselves once they have gone on the attack. The real funny part is that these folks are often having something less than Christian conversations up to that point.

One Seventh Day Adventist actually followed me across the parking lot hurling insults. When we parted,he yelled over his shoulder, all the way to his truck, “There is only one God.” We had been friends only minutes before.  I have left these conversations completely dumbfounded at how someone perfectly friendly one moment can become so hostile the next.

There are several pseudo Christian sects, that I have came into contact with, that makes the claim that Jesus Christ isn’t God. The very puzzling part is that they claim to be the “True Christians”, and to be “Bible believing.” They also insist on the King James Version of the scriptures, which they can hardly understand.

I say then, lets see what the Bible has to say on the matter. You can start with the Old Testament prophecies of Christ.

Therefore the Lord will give you this sign, the virgin shall be with child, and bear a son, and shall name him Immanuel. Is. 7:14

Immanuel literally means; With us is God.  Let’s look at another verse of scripture from Isaiah.

For a child is born to us, a son is given us; upon his shoulder dominion rests. They name him Wonder-Counselor, God-Hero, Father-Forever, Prince of Peace. Is. 9:5

Now, many of the pseudo Christian sects also make the claim that they never have to believe the Old Testament, except when it suits them to do so, of course.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things came to be through him, and without him nothing came to be, What came to be through him was life and this life was the light of the human race; the light shines in the darkness and the darkness has not overcome it. Jn 1:1-5

The Incarnation, that God took flesh, has always been a teaching of Christianity. The pseudo Christian sects love to quote St. Paul, out of context usually. But St Paul confirms what St John tells us when he says;

For in him dwells the whole fullness of the deity bodily, and you share in this fullness in him, who is the head of every principality and power. Col 2:9

Jesus even says of himself;

The Father [that is God] and I are one. Jn 10:30

I am the Alpha and Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end. Rev. 22:13

Now, was Jesus, and the Apostles, simply confused as to who Jesus is?

Well no, the Jewish leaders, in that day, understood exactly what was being said. That is why they wanted him crucified; for blasphemy.

The Jews answered him, “We are not stoning you for a good work but for blasphemy. You, a man, are making yourself God.” Jn. 10:33

For this reason the Jews tried all the more to kill him, because he not only broke the Sabbath but he also called God his own father, making himself equal to God. Jn. 5-17

Jesus said to them. “Amen, amen, I say to you, before Abraham came to be, I AM.” So they picked up stones to throw at him; but Jesus hid and went out of the temple area. Jn. 8:58-59

I would like to note here that I AM is the name Moses was given from the burning bush.

Jesus worked miracles, and did things that only God can do. He healed the sick, raised the dead, walked on water, and forgave sins.

I often hear the pseudo Christians charge “Jesus never said to worship me.” Funny then, that he accepted worship without correcting the worshipper. If St. Thomas was committing blasphemy, by calling our Lord God, then Jesus should have corrected him.

Then he said to Thomas, “Put your finger here and see my hands, and bring your hand and put it into my side, and do not be unbelieving, but believe.” Thomas answered and said to him, “My Lord and my God!” Jn. 20:27-28

St. Paul calls our Lord, Jesus, God;

…as we await the blessed hope, the appearance of the glory of the great God and of our savior Jesus Christ. Ti. 2:13

St. Paul also tells us;

Therefore I tell you that nobody speaking by the Spirit of God says, “Jesus be accursed.”  And no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit.” 1Cor. 12:3

St. Paul isn’t merely bestowing a royal title on Jesus. In the ancient world the word Lord was put in the place of God’s name, to avoid misusing the name of God. What St. Paul is saying is that Jesus is God. I remember during the Hippie Jesus movement that people would greet one another with “Jesus is Lord,” without really knowing what they were saying.

I will stand with St. John, when he says;

Who is the liar? Whoever denies that Jesus is the Christ. Whoever denies the Father and the Son, this is the antichrist. No one who denies the Son has the Father, But whoever confesses the Son has the Father as well.       1 Jn. 2:22-23

I invite you, "The True Christians,” and you the “Bible Believing” Christians to believe your Bibles. Stop using them for a cudgel to beat others over the head with.

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14 Comments

  1. What version of Bible you use? Isaiah 9:5 reads as follows: For all the armor the armed man is in tumult, and the garments rolled in blood, shall be for burning, for fuel of fire.

    Your points may be well taken, but your scholarship is sloppy.

    • In modern, western, Christianity, we have the notion of “THE BIBLE.” There are varying scripture traditions. An example is, in Judaism there are three scripture traditions; Torah, Neviim, and Ketuvim.
      In the different traditions; order of books, and verses may differ.
      In your scriptural traditions the verse I sited would most likey be Isaiah 9:6
      Thank you for your thought comment.

  2. Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by the command of God our Savior and of Christ Jesus our hope, 2. Bibles

  3. Well,
    Your thoughts on Jesus being God are not what the Bible teaches.

    1. Jesus is God’s son. He is spoken of as being the only begotten (“Single of its kind,”) Son. By virtue of his being the sole direct creation of his Father, the firstborn Son was unique, different from all others of God’s sons, all of whom were created or begotten by Jehovah through that firstborn Son, Jesus. Everything else came into existence through him. Therefore, he (Jesus) has a beginning. God, Jehovah, has no beginning. Jehovah has never died. Jesus was killed and brought back to life by his creator, his Father, Jehovah God. Jehovah is the Alfa and the Omega.

    2. The Hebrew form of the name Jesus means “Jehovah Is Salvation”; Christ is the equivalent of the Hebrew Ma•shi′ach (Messiah), meaning “Anointed One.”

    3. Jesus himself referred to his Father as “the only true God.” (John 17:3) Jehovah himself said: “Besides me there is no God.” (Isa. 44:6) The apostle Paul wrote that, to true Christians, “there is . . . one God the Father.” (1 Cor. 8:5, 6) So Jehovah is unique; no one else shares his position. Jehovah stands in utter contrast to all such objects of worship as idols, deified humans, and Satan. All these are false gods.

    4. Jesus is spoken of in the Scriptures as “a god,” even as “Mighty God.” (John 1:1; Isa. 9:6) But nowhere is he spoken of as being Almighty, as Jehovah is. (Gen. 17:1) Jesus is said to be “the reflection of [God’s] glory,” but the Father is the Source of that glory. (Heb. 1:3) Jesus in no way seeks the position of his Father. He said: “It is Jehovah your God you must worship, and it is to him alone you must render sacred service.” (Luke 4:8) He exists “in God’s form,” and the Father has commanded that “in the name of Jesus every knee should bend,” but this is all done “to the glory of God the Father.”—Phil. 2:5-11.

    5. John 20:17, RS: “Jesus said to her [Mary Magdalene], ‘Do not hold me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father; but go to my brethren and say to them, I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’” (So to the resurrected Jesus, the Father was God, just as the Father was God to Mary Magdalene. Interestingly, not once in Scripture do we find the Father addressing the Son as “my God.”)

    6. What did Thomas mean when he said to Jesus, “My Lord and my God”?

    Some scholars have viewed this expression as an exclamation of astonishment spoken to Jesus but actually directed to God, his Father. However, others claim the original Greek requires that the words be viewed as being directed to Jesus. Even if this is so, the expression “My Lord and my God” would still have to harmonize with the rest of the inspired Scriptures. Since the record shows that Jesus had previously sent his disciples the message, “I am ascending to my Father and your Father and to my God and your God,” there is no reason for believing that Thomas thought Jesus was the Almighty God. (Joh 20:17) John himself, after recounting Thomas’ encounter with the resurrected Jesus, says of this and similar accounts: “But these have been written down that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ the Son of God, and that, because of believing, you may have life by means of his name.”—Joh 20:30, 31.
    So, Thomas may have addressed Jesus as “my God” in the sense of Jesus’ being “a god” though not the Almighty God, not “the only true God,” to whom Thomas had often heard Jesus pray. (Joh 17:1-3)

    7. Finally, if Jesus is God?
    -Who did Satan kill?
    -Who said, “This is my Son who I approve”? Who was talking from heaven?
    -How could the Father be greater than Jesus?
    -Who did Jesus pray to?
    -Who did he teach people to pray to?
    -Who did the prophecies in the Hebrew Scripture point to, starting with Gen 3:15?

    • The force of logic
      When all this examination failed, the Jews tried to break down the man’s story by bluff. They pointed out that the cure was done on the Sabbath. God must be responsible for miracles, but God would not violate the Sabbath rest by working a miracle. To this bit of tortured theology the blind man opposed the facts. “Not from the beginning of the world has it been heard that anyone opened the eyes of a man born blind. If this man were not from God, he could do nothing,” he said (John 9:32-33).
      This logic was indisputable, so they cast him out of their presence. But the facts remained, and the facts have never been explained–unless we accept the fact that God was with Jesus Christ.
      That is the inescapable conclusion that follows from the existence of real miracles. This world runs down its own track, precisely repeating over and over again the same actions. The observed course of things becomes so clear and constant that we make “laws” to give it expression.
      “Whatever goes up, must come down,” we say. That it can go up, we do not deny. As long as some force greater than gravity works on it, it goes up. A ball goes up and up as long as it has the force of the bat behind it. An airplane stays aloft as long as its speed is great enough to overcome gravity.
      The only higher power in control of such forces, of course, is God. Doctors can cure; they cannot create life. Yet Jesus of Nazareth raised Lazarus from the dead. He did not cure him. Lazarus was not in a coma; he was dead. Christ recreated life in him. No man can do that, no angel, no devil. Only God is the master of life and death.
      So also with the greatest miracle of all, His own death and resurrection. He did what no man can do–He predicted His own death in precise detail. He said He would be killed in a most unusual way. He predicted that He would be betrayed to the Jews, condemned by them to death, and then delivered to the Gentiles to be mocked and spit upon and scourged and crucified. And on the third day He would rise again.

      http://www.tldm.org/news7/ChristisGod.htm

      • Sxylla2012, I have reviewed the link. I was curious, still, how the information supports that Jesus was God. Jesus himself never claimed to be God but that he was sent by God. The fact that Lazarus was raised from the dead does not support that Jesus was God Jesus prayed to his father (God, Jehovah) first before he called Lazarus to come out of the tomb (John 11:41-43). He prayed to God to reinforce to the crowd standing around that he was sent by God.

      • Hi,Steve.
        I am not sure how to help you out here exactly. If you look back up through the comments, you’ll see, that Max get’s it; not sure if he likes it.
        The opening of the Gospel of saint John is enough to convence me.
        John 8:58-59, before Abraham was; I AM
        John 10:30-33, The Father and I are one.
        Exodus 3:14, tell them I AM sent you
        John 8:19 if you knew me, you would know my father
        John 10:38 The Father is in me and I am in the Father
        John 12:45 whoever sees me, sees the one who sent me
        John 14:8-18 whoever has seen me has seen the Father

        The Gospels are full of the miracles of Christ. Jesus healing the blind, the lame, and healing lepmpers are all examples of him recreating life; only God, the Creator of all life, can do that.

        Have to get back to the grind stone, have a good a day.

  4. Steve,

    I’d like to take a stab at answering your points, but I have a couple of questions for you. Are you a Jehovah’s Witness in good standing? Are you born again?

    1. If I have a son, my son would be human. If God has a son, the Son would be of the same substance as God. Jesus is also referred to as the Son of Man. In your line of reasoning, Son of Man means Jesus is human, and Son of God means that Jesus is human, right? Jesus is the Alpha and Omega, because He is the First and the Last (Rev. 1:17), and the First and the Last is identified as the Alpha and Omega in Revelation 22:13, which is clearly Jesus speaking.

    2. The meaning of Jesus’ name doesn’t necessarily help either of our cases, however Jesus has the name that is above all names (Philippians 2:9), including above Jehovah.

    3. There is only one God. Jesus is God (John 20:28). The Father is God and the Holy Spirit is God (Acts 5:3-4). Jehovah’s Witnesses say that Jesus is a god. However there is only one true God and many false gods. To them, I would say is Jesus a true God or is He a false god? Also, Jesus is the only Lord (1 Cor. 8:4-6), but the Father is referred to as Lord in the Old Testament (and I mean Lord not LORD, such as Exodus 23:17, Genesis 15:2). Is the Father not the one true Lord?

    4. The Alpha and Omega is the Almighty (Revelation 1:8).

    5. In the New Testament, The Father is usually referred to as God, and Jesus is referred to as Lord. Jesus became nothing (Philippians 2:7), and was born under the law (Galatians 4:4). He had to obey the whole law, including the first of the Ten Commandments.

    6. If I had to sum up your quotation, it would be: We don’t know what that means.

    However, it is clear what it means. Thomas was a strict monotheist, and was convinced that Jesus is God.

    7.” Who did Satan kill?”
    I’m not sure what you’re referring to.
    -Who said, “This is my Son who I approve”? Who was talking from heaven?
    The Father was speaking from heaven. There is one God in three persons. You reveal that you don’t understand the Trinity when you ask that question.
    -How could the Father be greater than Jesus?
    Jesus became nothing.
    -Who did Jesus pray to?
    Jesus had fellowship with the Father for eternity, why would He live as an atheist when He came to earth? Furthermore, He had to obey the law.
    -Who did he teach people to pray to?
    He told them to pray to the Father and to Himself (John 14:14)
    -Who did the prophecies in the Hebrew Scripture point to, starting with Gen 3:15?
    Jesus

    Thanks,
    Bill

    • Hi Bill.
      Very thought provoking. A bit much for me to tackle at one time.

      So, not to be disrespectful of the time and effort that you put into your comment, I will state up front that I am one of Jehovah’s Witnesses. That being the case, I am thinking you should know where I stand on the trinity.

      However, many people have different views on just what the trinity means. So, not to be presumptuous, what is your view, if you do not mind me asking?

  5. skylla2012,
    Just to be clear. Is it your position that Jesus and Jehovah are the same person?

  6. Steve,

    I would agree that many people, even those who would say they’re Christians, don’t really know much about the Trintiy, or are confused about it. However, to the best of my knowledge, there is only one teaching on the Trinity.

    The Trinity is one God in three persons. Jesus is God, the Father is God, the Holy Spirit is God, but Jesus isn’t the Father isn’t the Holy Spirit. God is one being in three persons. For example, a brick has being, but it doesn’t have personhood. I am one person with one being. God is infinite, and isn’t limited to one person.

    Yahweh is the only true God. Usually the Old Testament is referring to the Father, however there are sometimes when Jesus or the Holy Spirit are in the Old Testament, and are referred to as Yahweh.

    By the way, I’m not Catholic; I’m a Protestant.

    Thanks,
    Bill

    • skylla2012,
      Sorry for taking so long to get back.

      The Trinity. Seems to me, that there are many versions of the Trinity. Either way, it is not taught in the bible.

      The New Encyclopædia Britannica says: “Neither the word Trinity, nor the explicit doctrine as such, appears in the New Testament, nor did Jesus and his followers intend to contradict the Shema in the Old Testament: ‘Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord’ (Deut. 6:4)

      The New Catholic Encyclopedia states: “The formulation ‘one God in three Persons’ was not solidly established, certainly not fully assimilated into Christian life and its profession of faith, prior to the end of the 4th century. But it is precisely this formulation that has first claim to the title the Trinitarian dogma. Among the Apostolic Fathers, there had been nothing even remotely approaching such a mentality or perspective.”—(1967), Vol. XIV, p. 299.

      In The Encyclopedia Americana we read: “Christianity derived from Judaism and Judaism was strictly Unitarian [believing that God is one person]. The road which led from Jerusalem to Nicea was scarcely a straight one. Fourth century Trinitarianism did not reflect accurately early Christian teaching regarding the nature of God; it was, on the contrary, a deviation from this teaching.”—(1956), Vol. XXVII, p. 294L.

      In short, the whole thinking came about because of Constantine who was not a Christian. It was he who sided with those that believed that Jesus was God (Jehovah). He did not do this because of any religious conviction but rather to protect the empire. He saw how divisive religion was. So to solidify his domain, he brought the debate to a close. All of this took place in Nicaea with most of the bishops not promoting a trinity. The only thing they were debating was nature of Jesus’ role. The spirit was not even in the equation.

  7. Skylla2012,

    Maybe you should take a few more weeks and respond to the questions I asked. You brought up all those canned Watchtower arguments, and I refuted them, and now you’re changing the subject. I’m sure the last comment is copy and pasted from your Watchtower CD. Apparently the Watchtower doesn’t provide responses to the questions I asked you, and your organization’s evangelism strategy relies in catching biblically illiterate people off guard on their doorsteps.

    Here’s a quotation from “The DaVinci Code” (from this article about that movie), which seems to echo your arguments well.

    “Indeed,” Teabing said. “Stay with me. During this fusion of religions, Constantine needed to strengthen the new Christian religion, and held a famous ecumenical gathering known as the Council of Nicaea.”
    Sophie had heard of it only insofar as its being the birthplace of the Nicene Creed.
    “At this gathering,” Teabing said, “many aspects of Christianity were debated and voted upon—the date of Easter, the role of the bishops, the administration of sacraments, and, of course, the divinity of Jesus.”
    “I don’t follow. His divinity?”
    “My dear,” Teabing declared, “until that moment in history, Jesus was viewed by His followers as a mortal prophet . . . a great and powerful man, but a man nonetheless. A mortal.”
    “Not the Son of God?”
    “Right,” Teabing said, “Jesus’ establishment as ‘the Son of God’ was officially proposed and voted on by the Council of Nicaea.”
    “Hold on. You’re saying Jesus’ divinity was the result of a vote?”
    “A relatively close vote at that,” Teabing added.

    Here’s a quote from Ignatiaus that predates the Council of Nicaea by a couple hundred years:

    “My spirit is but an offscouring of the cross, which is a scandal to the unbelieving, but to us it is salvation and life eternal. Where is the wise man? Where is the disputer? Where is the boasting of those who are called understanding? For our God, Jesus the Christ, was conceived by Mary according to a dispensation of God, from the seed of David, yes, but of the Holy Spirit as well.” (Ephesians 18)

    Of course you won’t see that quote in Watchtower publications, even though they do quote Ignatius out of context to support their viewpoint.

    If you’re wrong about the deity of Jesus, you will give account for your own sins in hell. You should really trust in Jesus alone for your forgiveness. He has the name above all names, and He can save you. I hope that you and I can spend eternity together with Jesus.

    I’m sure you have family in the Watchtower Society, and it would be painful to leave, but Jesus said (Matt 10:37-39), “Anyone who loves his father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me; 38and anyone who does not take his cross and follow me is not worthy of me. 39Whoever finds his life will lose it, and whoever loses his life for my sake will find it.

    Thanks,
    Bill

    • That wasn’t my comment Bill; that was Steve’s. I am the guy that was defending the divinity of Jesus. I diagree with Steve’s take on Constitine, but don’t really have the time right now. Closing the comments after a couple of weeks might be a good idea from here on.


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